From: Ian Stanley BIGFOOT COM> Date: 22 sep 2002 Subject: Re: Another request for rules clarification This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01C2627C.4EBA1580 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You can't drop a piece in a place from which there is no legal move ie=20 - pawns / lances may be not be dropped on the 9th rank - if they where = dropped on the 8th they would promote after their next move. - likewise knights may not be dropped on the 8th or 9th ranks=20 in the case of manadatory promotion the piece is promoted AFTER the last = LEGAL move made eg pawn moved from the 8th rank to the 9th. as dropping = on the 9th rank is illegal=20 A drop is not a move - it is taken instead of a move [the turn is still = recorded as a move however] furthermore , on the question reguarding whether a piece has to move in order to be = promoted. in order to promote a piece HAS to - therefore if a pawn has previously = moved to rank 7=20 and has not promoted - it must move again in order to promote on = completion of its move to rank 8. If you chose not to promote there - = the next time it moves [ie to rank 9]=20 it will automatically promote. I would recommend to the beginner an excellent book : SHOGI FOR BEGINNERS by John Fairburn published by THE ISHI PRESS =20 ISBN no 4-87187-201-7 price $11.95 it covers all the rules clearly opening lines tactics and castling=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: T. Lawrence Pitts=20 To: SHOGI-L TECHUNIX TECHNION AC IL=20 Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2002 8:31 PM Subject: Another request for rules clarification Here's a question: suppose I drop a pawn [on a file without any other = pawn of mine, of course] on the last rank of the board... I understand = that it *has to* promote, since otherwise it would not have any legal = moves available to it. The " Shogi Rules" that came with my set say "At = the end of any move beginning or ending in the enemy camp a piece may = promote." Well, when I place the pawn on that last rank, doesn't that = count as a move "ending in the enemy camp"?? So, can the pawn promote = there and then, or does it actually have to make a move in order to be = promoted? ... =20 =20 The same question applies to the lance, of course, or a knight = entering the last two ranks. Without promotion, they would have no legal = moves on any subsequent turn. =20 In my prior question I thought I had it all "squared away," but when I = started playing, I realized that the actual moment of promotion changes = the pattern of attack/defense and it's critical to know if, in these = three situations of "mandatory promotion", the piece is promoted when = placed rather than when next moved. =20 Some of the rules I've read seem to be concerned only with how the = pieces move... and if that were the only consideration, then it wouldn't = matter whether a piece was promoted or not until it did move. But, from = the point of view of how the patterns of attack and defense change, it = makes a big difference if the promotion is "forced" as it is placed. =20 Sorry if I seem unusually dense about this... I sure appreciate your = patience with a "newbie". =20 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002 ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01C2627C.4EBA1580 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
You = can't drop a=20 piece in a place from which there is no legal move
 
ie
 - pawns / lances may be not be = dropped on the=20 9th rank - if they where dropped on the 8th they would promote after = their next=20 move.
- likewise knights may not be dropped = on the 8th or=20 9th ranks
 
in the case of manadatory promotion the = piece is=20 promoted AFTER the last LEGAL move made eg pawn moved from the 8th = rank to=20 the 9th. as dropping on the 9th rank is illegal
 
A drop is not a move - it is taken = instead of a=20 move [the turn is still recorded as a move however]
 
 
 
furthermore ,
 
on the question reguarding whether a = piece has to=20 move in order to be promoted.
 
in order to promote a piece HAS to = - therefore if  a pawn has previously moved = to rank 7=20
and has not promoted - it must move = again in order=20 to promote on completion of its move to rank 8. If you chose not to = promote=20 there - the next time it moves [ie to rank 9]
it will automatically = promote.
 
 
 
 
I would recommend to the beginner an = excellent book=20 :
 
SHOGI FOR BEGINNERS by John = Fairburn
 published by THE ISHI = PRESS  =20
 
ISBN no 4-87187-201-7   price = $11.95
 
it covers all the rules clearly opening = lines=20 tactics and castling
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 ORO NET" title=3Dtlpitts ORO NET>T. Lawrence = Pitts=20
To: TECHUNIX TECHNION AC IL"=20 = title=3DSHOGI-L TECHUNIX TECHNION AC IL>SHOGI-L@TECHUNIX TECHNION AC IL=20
Sent: Sunday, September 22, = 2002 8:31=20 PM
Subject: Another request for = rules=20 clarification

Here's a question: suppose I = drop a pawn [on=20 a file without any other pawn of mine, of course] on the last rank of = the=20 board... I understand that it *has to* promote, since otherwise it = would not=20 have any legal moves available to it. The " Shogi Rules" that came = with my set=20 say "At the end of any move beginning or ending in the enemy camp a = piece may=20 promote."  Well, when I place the pawn on that last rank, doesn't =  that count as a move "ending in the enemy camp"?? So, can = the pawn=20 promote there and then, or does it actually have to make a = move in=20 order to be promoted? ... 
 
The same question applies to the = lance, of=20 course, or a knight entering the last two ranks. Without promotion, = they would=20 have no legal moves on any subsequent turn.
 
In my prior question I thought I had = it all=20 "squared away," but when I started playing, I realized that the actual = moment=20 of promotion changes the pattern of attack/defense and it's critical = to know=20 if, in these three situations of "mandatory promotion", the = piece is=20 promoted when placed rather than when next moved.
 
Some of the rules I've read seem to = be concerned=20 only with how the pieces move... and if that were the only=20 consideration, then it wouldn't matter whether a piece was promoted or = not=20 until it did move.  But, from the point of view of how = the=20 patterns of attack and defense change, it makes a big = difference if=20 the promotion is "forced" as it is placed.
 
Sorry if I seem unusually dense about = this...  I sure appreciate your patience with a "newbie". =20
 

---
Outgoing mail is certified = Virus=20 Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: = 6.0.391=20 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date:=20 9/19/2002
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