From: Pieter Stouten <stouten <at> SHOGI <dot> NET>
Date: 17 apr 2000
Subject: Re: Shogi Rules (Re: 2 funny things happened)

Some good-night Shogi stories from the vaults of Shogi history.

On 00/04/16 at 15:03 -0400, Larry Kaufman wrote:

>I
>recall one incident at the Mind Sports Olympics where a strong (western)
>player tried to refuse to accept a time forfeit that he felt he did not
>deserve, though the TD ruled that it must stand.
>
The clock apparently had not beeped to indicate byoyomi, but this
could not be reproduced after the game when the clock did beep.
However, what if it could be reproduced? I would still rule the
result stands as it is the players' responsibility to verify that the
clock works before they start. Or is it the organizer's
responsibility? And what if the clock did work when the game started,
but failed later on?

Although the above result stood as I had initially ruled, I proposed
to the FESA ratings officer not to count the game for Elo rating
purposes. That was acceptable to both players, but wasn't that
inconsistent on my part?

>Never have I seen anyone
>try to claim victory by any shady or dubious method.
>
I recall one incident where a chess player "by accident" dropped the
clock on the floor in a blitz Shogi game. Although picking it up with
only one hand, he managed to turn his clock back to give him a few
minutes more.

>In my opinion, a
>major reason for clear rules is that without them players who are very nice
>and/or shy may be reluctant to claim games that they really do deserve to
>win, while less unselfish folks will have no compunction about doing so.  I
>don't like to see someone's good will turned to his detriment.
>
Or he may claim the game and feel bad about it. When the rules are
clear and everybody is used to applying them then nobody needs to
feel uncomfortable. Indeed, taking it to the extreme, if player A
makes an illegal move and player B presses the clock (to allow A to
take the move back and make another move) then indeed A can claim the
game because B pressed the clock without making a move. That may
sound ridiculous (as Mike Sandeman surely thinks), but the fact is
that A by knowingly violating the rules has himself to blame for the
consequence.

On 00/04/14 at 10:39 +0900, Mike Sandeman wrote:

>If my opponent makes a nifu I press the clock and point it out, most
>players change their move. A king that can be taken is a different
>case, the player will resign.
>
Interesting. I remember a player being in an absolutely lost
position. Let's call him Ian Spence. Ian played a silly bishop move
that served no purpose but to give check, delaying the inevitable by
one move. His opponent (let's call him Mike Sandeman) had not seen he
was in check and proceded with his mating attack. Ian looked up in
surprise and Mike realized his blunder. Mike got red as a beet and
made clear in no uncertain terms that Ian had no choice but to allow
Mike to take the move back and protect his king. The reason Mike gave
was along the lines that Ian's move was ridiculous, served no purpose
and therefore should not have been made.

Good night,

Pieter